There's been some discussions earlier about codes found on Sony /CBS releases in the format yy-xxxxxx-zz as described here and here. Some of these codes are in the format 08-xxxxx-20 and are used on releases manufactured by Sony/CBS in Holland for other labels and distributors, Mute Records being one of the most well known of those other labels.
I've been curious about these matrix numbers so I did some investigation. I found out that the plant manufacturing vinyl with this type of code is situated in Haarlem just outside of Amsterdam. It was operated by CBS/Sony between 1969 and June 1998 when a company called Record Industry took over. The pressing plant is still active and claim to be the worlds largest, you can find their homepage here: http://www.recordindustry.com
I sent a mail to them asking what those codes are, here's the answer I got:
08-nnnnnn-20 codes were used by Sony Music (and later by Record Industry) for all product they pressed and was not for their own catalog.
I don't think other plants use these codes, I have never seen it.
I would describe these codes as internal factory sequence number
I did some more investigating and noticed that Record Industry continued to use this format (08-nnnnnn-20) up until about 2004 when they seem to have dropped the 08- and -20 and continued using just the sequence number. The sequence number continues up until today. In 2009 it had reached about 85000 and the oldest in this sequence I have seen is 11545 from 1989. Other sequences exist, between 1984 and 1995 I've seen from 22837 to 33205.
Bong
Some of these codes are in the format 08-xxxxx-20 and are used on releases manufactured by Sony/CBS in Holland for other labels and distributors, Mute Records being one of the most well known of those other labels.
08-xxxxxx-zz: Releases manufactured in the Netherlands for other (non-CBS/Sony) labels
Bong
I sent a mail to them asking what those codes are, here's the answer I got:
That's great info. I will add this information to the wiki-page. The xxxxxx part is indeed a sequence number that has no link to other codes such as catalog numbers on those releases, so seems to be defined by the pressing plant. On Sony / CBS releases, the xxxxxx part is related to the catalog number of the release.
jweijde
It wasn't clear in that topic yet and I didn't think about the wiki page. Atleast we now have some more details
Yeah well the wiki page is now called "Identifiers on European CBS and Sony Music releases" which doesn't cover the content completely anymore. These codes are used on releases that were manufactured in (former) European CBS and Sony Music plants, no matter on what label they were released.
A variant of the coding can f.i. also be found on EMI releases manufactured by Sony DADC in Austria:
http://discogs.versitio.com/release/151253 has 2029273-11 as the matrix number. The first two digits ("country") digits of the scheme are not present here, but starts with the EMI catalog number. The last two ("format") digits match the coding scheme described on the wiki page though.
For those interested, here's some history of the Record Industry pressing plant:
1958: Pressing plant founded as the pressing plant of the Artone label (which was founded in 1956)
1960's: Artone becomes the distributor of CBS
1966: CBS acquires a 50% stake in Artone
1969: CBS takes full control of Artone (start of CBS Grammofoonplaten B.V.?)
1988: Sony acquires CBS
auboisdormant
So, just to be sure, when entering these codes to the BAOI, what description should be used?
You mean, when it's not entered as (part of) the matrix?
I guess identifier is the most specific term we can use to describe what it is. ;-)
Thus I think, it's important to specify where it appears on the release.
fisonic
You mean, when it's not entered as (part of) the matrix?
Eh, but it's often printed on the sleeve, and erroneously entered as a catalog number. And since it's not a matrix number, or a part of the matrix, it would be incorrect to add it as part of the matrix, no? ;p
I would just like to know what description to use now that it's known what the code is. Would also make commenting easier when asking people to move it to the BAOI.
fisonic
I guess identifier is the most specific term we can use to describe what it is. ;-)
This is how the employee at Record Industry described it:
Bong
I would describe these codes as internal factory sequence number
So maybe that's what to call it, or "Manufacturing Plant Sequence Number", "Pressing Plant Sequence Number", "Pressing Plant Catalog#" or something like that.
I think that we anyway can add to the notes section "Pressed by Sony Music, Haarlem, Holland" on releases between 1988 and June 1998, and "Pressed by CBS, Haarlem, Holland" before and "Pressed by Record Industry, Haarlem, Holland" after.
^^
That is for releases manufactured in Holland with 08-nnnnnnn-20 numbers in the run-out area, or without the 08- and .20 parts after 2004, it's often easy to tell that they've been pressed at that plant anyway.
Bong
So maybe that's what to call it, or "Manufacturing Plant Sequence Number", "Pressing Plant Sequence Number", "Pressing Plant Catalog#" or something like that.
I wouldn't do that, since yy-xxxxxx-zz numbers can appear anywhere, on any physical part of a release. Unique identifiers can even appear on a sticker, like here.
Whenever such a number is applied by the manufacturing plant in the sense you meant, it will be part of the matrix anyway, and thus unambiguously be entered as matrix-field already. No need to specify that any further, in my opinion.
auboisdormant
Eh, but it's often printed on the sleeve, and erroneously entered as a catalog number.
Exactly, that's what I meant. That's not to be entered as matrix-field, but 'other' - and I suggest to specify the location of that identifier in the corresponding free text field.
fisonic
No need to specify that any further, in my opinion.
Why not? I mean if we know what the number is, why not specify it? I really don't see any reason to leave it out, it would also clear out the confusion of what it is since not everyone reads the forums. True, the same code can be found from the matrix most of the time, but, it's part of the matrix. ;)
fisonic
but 'other' - and I suggest to specify the location of that identifier in the corresponding free text field.
The number can be printed in several places on the release indeed, but again that doesn't really give a reason to ignore a perfectly valid specification for the code. You can always add the location as well, you know, the more information the better.
Because we simply don't know what those numbers are, other than identifiers in the broadest sense.
Whenever they appear outside of the actual matrix, the only relation we can see is that to the catalog number. And we have agreed that they are not catalog numbers themselves.
auboisdormant
"Pressing Plant Sequence Number"
I personally like this one. :)
Just click the image link I provided above, and you'll see that this doesn't make sense. That identifier is certainly not a pressing plant sequence number.
fisonic
Just click the image link I provided above, and you'll see that this doesn't make sense. That identifier is certainly not a pressing plant sequence number.
This topic is only about the 08-xxxxxx-20 codes which were/are used by CBS/Sony's pressing plant and Record Industry
Your image shows 31-489020-10 which is different.
